7 years ago
Arrangement Types

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SeekingArrangement.com is home to all types of sugars seeking all types of arrangements.  Here are some of the most commonly agreed on traits of an arrangement:

No-Strings-Attached: Casual relationship, non-exclusive

Mutually Beneficial: Mentoring, companionship, support

Short-Term: 60% seek arrangements 6 months or shorter

Upfront: Pre-negotiated expectations and boundaries

Which aspects of an arrangement are most essential to you?

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213 Responses to “Arrangement Types”

  1. Tatiana says:

    I’m more upfront…I want cash & I want to give him companionship….nothing else really

  2. Michael AZ Alleycat says:

    Hey Stormy – how was the day at the races? And the rest of the weekend?

  3. travelingsb says:

    @nyc sb – fyi its not the sd I spoke to you about, I followed my instincts and called him out on a few of my concerns and he vanished..he is one to stear clear of:)

  4. travelingsb says:

    Oops sorry for all the typos…iphone blogging:)

  5. travelingsb says:

    I have been gone for two days and have lots to catch up on..I can’t remember who commented on my location but I’m from wisconsin. My past sds have been in new york…
    I wanted some advice..I have had a few successful long term and they have all been upfront generous arrangements..I’m have been talking to a new pot and we have great connection even though we have not met. I am coming to nyc next week to meet him. He is adorable and I love his humor. The problem is he has not talked about a financial arrangement .. I really like this one and don’t want to wreck it by talking about money. However, I was clear in my profile I’m looking for a financial arrangement. In his profile his allowance amount fits.. any advice? I don’t mind being patient with this one but I don’t want him to be a time waster either..

  6. Lily says:

    My regular dating adventures are leading me straight back into why I don’t dig the men in this country. I’m way too much for them. Too complicated, too intensive, too strong, too willful, too much baggage, too wild, too “cu-cu-cu-curly” (for SATC fans). This te at least it all came to a head quickly. Being my partner in this life is not for the weak of spirit or confidence and this country is full of insecure, angst-ridden, melancholic men. I scare the bejeezus out of them and they fear they aren’t enough. And then wish me well and that I’ll find someone worthy enough for me. F that.

    I’m verrrrrrry tempted to turn to sugar…… I had a springtime pot from Scotland text me today and ask to finally meet. me for dinner, if I’d allow him the honor of flying in to my country to meet me. Another pot in Boston (never met) just yesterday invited me stateside the first week of September, which sounds fun right about now.

  7. smitten kitten says:

    Hello everyone!! I’m so happy to finally have found this site :) I’m posting because not only did I find my way here, but I’m going to attend this meet up tomorrow in NYC and I have so many questions~Has anyone else gone before that can share what it’s like? I’ve never had a SD and have no idea what the etiquette for tomorrow nights party should be like. Do you walk up to them? Do they come up to us? Is it rude to ask them what they have to offer? And if not, is there a classy way to go about it? Do you talk about arrangements right there if you like someone enough, or do you just set up a date to talk about it next time? What are the most common arrangements…or the most reasonable? I’m so excited! haha Thanks in advance everyone :)

  8. Lily says:

    Reddamsel, attractiveness (inside & out) is the number 1 thing an SD is looking for. Photos are of primary importance. They don’t have time in their busy lives to get hooked on your profile text, pursue you and just cross their fingers that you’ve got a smile that gives them butterflies.

    These are not platonic relationships and men are extremely visual. You must have a primary photo on your profile that vehemently entices him, to stand a chance in this VERY competitive dating pool.

  9. Reddamsel38 says:

    Wow Green Eyed thatounds very promising. Congrats. You handeled that poise and grace. Let me ask you something from a woman’spoint of view. I seem to be having a problem with posting a pic of myself.I feel a certain way about doing that. I know it’s necessary, but I seem to be stuck on that point only. I know that having a pic is important so that pot sds can see what their dealing with… But I feel that the connection is more important than what a person looks like.

  10. Green Eyed Sugar Lady says:

    Good Morning,

    @ Lily what was not very pleasant about your date, if you don’t mind my asking? I have a regular date tonight myself, although with someone quite a bit younger so I expect it will be pretty casual and light, and a break from sugar searching.

    @ Spice, yes I think meeting before going into sex talk is the proper order of things! I am sorry, you have my sympathy, I’ve run into this myself… a lot. You’re not alone. Nothing wrong with some flirting, and the implication of fun things to come, but in my opinion it shouldn’t go any further than that. It’s really off putting when one is trying to have an actual conversation and get to know the other person and all they want to talk about is sex. Personally I am far from a prude and very uninhibited, but we have to get to a certain place before that side of me comes out to play. :)

    I answered an ad on CL a couple of weeks ago that certainly sounded like the real thing (can be rare on CL, I know but it was worded correctly) but in our first (and only) phone conversation I was being asked what I liked to do sexually…. I tried to give the benefit of the doubt, be gracious, and steer the conversation to just flirtation with the promise we could go into more details at a later time. In retrospect I should have just ended it right there.

    We arranged a time/place to meet the following weekend with the understanding that this was just a meeting to see if there was chemistry and if we wanted to take things from there. Then I got an email during the week that (without going into detail) implied that something was supposed to happen on this first date. Which was not as we had discussed before. I also got a couple of emails during the week that he wanted to meet sooner- well, one, the weekend was his idea, and two, I am not going to drop everything and mix up my own schedule to accommodate this with someone I haven’t even met.

    Call me unspontaneous if you will! I’m definitely willing to accommodate someone with whom I have established a connection, or in some certain other circumstances, but not this time. So I was feeling pretty uncomfortable and very seriously considering cancelling- and then he did the day before we were supposed to meet. I was relieved. I responded and said that was fine. I figured he had found something better (i.e., willing to sleep with him for money) and that was that.

    I get an email during the week that he took care of whatever had come up and that he still wanted to get together. I didn’t reply, then a day or two later I get another email saying he is sorry we have lost touch and would like to reconnect, and that he just withdrew $1000 from his bank account. Want some? If you put it that way, actually, no, I don’t. How tacky and insulting. Don’t wave money in my face. I’d rather take in bottles and cans and dig for change in my car seats and purse and keep my dignity, thank you. I sent an email politely declining his offer and told him I didn’t think we were on the same page.

    One a somewhat more hopeful note, I did meet a pot last week that is the real thing… we made a nice connection, but he was on his way out of town. I haven’t heard anything from him since our email exchange right after meeting… I do understand he is busy, but I also know sometimes disappearances do happen even after a great first meeting. I’m cautiously optimistic at this point. I also received an email from a pot on another site from someone who lives out of state but comes to my city for business. He said he will be in town next week but there are no confirmed dates or plans as of yet, so we’ll see what happens there.

  11. Spice says:

    Oh sorry forgot to say good morning sugars. Im just a little bummed.

  12. Spice says:

    Ugh! Yet anther dod. I spent MY time trying to get to know this guy and all he wants to talk about is sex :( . Shouldn’t at least meet first before discussing sex.

  13. Stormcat says:

    Good Morning Cats and Kittens
    I’m blogging from heaven :)
    Getting ready to go to the track!
    Yay

  14. Lily says:

    Regular dating is weird.

    I wish it weren’t the case but I am starting to remember what drove me away from traditional dating/relationships.

    This is not very pleasant.

  15. Lily says:

    Hi Photogirl!!

  16. photogirl says:

    Hello everyone! It’s been a very long time since I’ve been on here… nice to see some familiar names!

    I hope everyone is doing well!

    Lily – Congrats on the new house :)

  17. TexasSugah says:

    Hey all..

    WOW I have missed alot. I mean ALOT. I feel like I’ll never catch up with everything. I’ll have to go back read and repost.

    My two sugars have lost their damn minds. BOTH of them. One just has to go period. The other one read my blog and tripped out. He claimed that I should spend more of my time with my Matchmaker suitors than him. I haven’t met anyone with that pursuit. And what is he upset about? He’s married. *rolls eyes* The first is just a fool.

    I have met someone here and we have been talking. Although we will be meeting in a couple of weeks, he’s flying in for the day, he sent me a partial allowance. He’s a real sweetie and a keeper.

    Tonight I have a regular date. How I keep this all straight, I have no idea. I am NERVOUS and really shouldn’t be. This guy thinks I hung the moon. It’s our first real date. Oh gosh.

    You know with all this sugar flying around and dating.. I’ve fooled around only ONCE this month. GEEZ!

    Later y’all

  18. Noledgeseeker says:

    Sasha, how are things going for you any sugar yet?

  19. Sasha says:

    Hope everyone is having a good sugar day!

  20. Jessica says:

    oh that’s a good idea! I don’t think anyone can view my profile yet it said approval pending =(

  21. Spice says:

    Congrats Lily on the home! Good day sugas! I’m a newbie myself but I browse other SB pages for tips on what a profile should look like.

  22. Reddamsel38 says:

    Lily congrats on your move into your new home!

  23. Reddamsel38 says:

    Midwest thanks for that. I’ll try that out. But you get where Im coming from right? I just feel funny putting my face out there. Has anyone else felt like that before?
    @Stormcat have fun sweetie.

    @SD Guru whatyou got planned for the weekend

  24. Reddamsel38 says:

    Welcome newbies Lynn, Jessica. This is the place for advice, very sage very wise advice.

  25. NYC SB says:

    stormy – could i handle 3 sds? you tell me… you have met me! besides, who is going to entice alleycat to make the trip to NYC? i also can bring back up as needed :p

    hey lils – yay for move in! wish i was at the housewarming

  26. Noledgeseeker says:

    lynn, jessica, wecome.

    coffee…

  27. Stormcat says:

    Good Morning Sugarland, Well it’s 11:00 and I’m just about to head out for the station. I guess I’m ready for this. I want everything to be perfect but . . . Aw ain’t een clooose ta-that!!! :(
    Well I’m sure that the weekend will be awesome anyway! And thanks for all the encouragement I get here. I’m not sure if it makes me more sane or more crazy. But whichever it is, feels great. No wonder the blog is addictive. 😉

  28. Midwest SB says:

    DW – Good points for pondering.

    Good morning sugars! Nothing like the smells of bacon, coffee and cinnamon buns filling the house and a happy little boy ready to go camping! It’s the weekend!!!!!

  29. Lily says:

    She sure can!!!!

    Morning, all! Afternoon here & I’m halfway done w/ my move into my first home-of-my-own!

  30. Stormcat says:

    NYC SB ~ well . . . I don’t know . . . you think you can handle 3 SD’s in sarge mode?

  31. Stormcat says:

    Lynn, Jessica ~ welcome, this is the place.

  32. Jessica says:

    Hi everyone!!

    I’m new to this site (and the sugar world) and I could REALLY use some help and advice! For instance, should I get a premium membership or not? I’m skeptical because what if I invest my money and never get an arrangement. Also I would like some advice on how to make my profile better because i see that my page has been looked at but that’s it, I only received two emails from total creepers! =( please help me! I’ve been keeping up with the last two blogs and you all seem absolutely wonderful!! I hope you guys can help me. =)

    Hope to hear from someone soon!

    Jessie <3

  33. Lynn says:

    Is there any special place to ask questions, or do we just ask on here?

  34. Dandelion Wine says:

    JSB & Noledgeseeker – ah, but what to do when hearing about future plans makes your heart pound? What if you are the one that needs a wake-up call? The other kind of situation is easy…

    Midwest, how do you make a decision to park it (or at least slow down to a speed limit) when you just newly remembered what pure joy and exhilaration driving fast brings you, and the road seems so invitingly empty? Of course there’s a speed trap right after that hill and you should have seen it coming…

    SD Guru, what lesson was that? And what if it’s not a complete lie – as in it was true at the time, but then things changed?

    PS: my questions at this point are purely theoretical, the answer won’t make a shred of difference , just want to learn for the future :)

  35. NYC SB says:

    stormy – what is this i hear? a nyc meeting… i am not invited? well thats mean! and you too SD Guru… i have been spelling ur name right for a week! off i go to cry myself to sleep…

  36. Beach_Girl says:

    Midwest~ Always girl… Thank you!

  37. Midwest SB says:

    ROFLMAO! Stormie – you rock!!! Is he in the library with a smoking revolver?

    Beach – I’m here for you kitten! You will be awesome at this…you just have to get your head in the right place! You’re so smart and incredibly determined. Carry on and make it happen girl! Be FIERCE!!

  38. Beach_Girl says:

    Midwest~ Love you girl, Thank you so much….You are really Great!

    Storm~ HI!

  39. Stormcat says:

    Midvest dawlink ~ it’s elementarrrry. . . I awlrrrready know ze anssswer . . . But I mussst have prrroof . . . so I shall not rrrreveal it until ze moment iss rrrright!!!

  40. Midwest SB says:

    My goodness…Stormcat has donned his cape, Sherlock Holmes hat, pipe and magnifying glass. Will he solve the mystery?

    Spice – Hilarious! Wait until Christmas when we start singing:
    “All I want for Christmas is a new SD, a sweet SD, a fun SD…”

    Red – I strongly suggest having the men offer you opinions on which pictures to post. As far as being discreet…I have used
    sillohuette , photos where they are cleverly cropped to show nice features without the whole face, etc. They worked quite well. Even the ones I have on my current (hidden) profile are somewhat discreet, but I did get compliments on the regularly. Download the free Pandora software…it’s great for editing. I live in a small town and in a position that would enable me to be recognized by a local man of means. Hence, preferring to date out of the area.

  41. Spice says:

    It would be ideal for me to have a non NSA, non husband, more friend like, discreet, exclusive, mutually beneficial, roughly 6 month to a year, very upfront, respectful, fun, honest arrangement.

    Let me copy and paste this to my profile.

  42. Stormcat says:

    SD Guru . . . who is this SD . . . guru. . . ?

    Sort of like the question: Is there life on other planets?

    One of the principles of the universe is that: If there is any possibility that something might happen no matter how statistically remote that possability might be, it will eventually happen.

    So the only question that remains is has SD Guru happened or is he only a possability and won’t be an actuallity for another couple of million years or so?

    Oh jeeze! I’m goin stir crazy. I think I’ll go out and get some dinner!
    Catch yall later

  43. Reddamsel38 says:

    Have a good weekend everyone! Goodnight.

  44. Reddamsel38 says:

    oh I wish I could get a weekend sd. That would be ideal for me. well they say if you say it out to the universe it will happen. So im going to yell it. I WOULD LIKE TO HAVE A NSA BENEFICIAL ARRANGEMNT WITH A KIND, ATTRACTIVE SD PLEASE!

  45. Reddamsel38 says:

    Hey is anybody on here follow on twitt?

  46. Reddamsel38 says:

    Good evening all.
    ok on to what has been on my mind today. I can’t seem to decide on a pic for my profile. I’ve seen other profile pics and I just can’t seem to make a decision on mine. I feel a certain way with putting my best face forward. I’m a very discreet person. I know you can blur out your face but the whole purpose of this site is to see what each person looks like right? SD GURU can you help me out with this please? Any other feed back would be welcomed. Thanks.

  47. Reddamsel38 says:

    @Alleycat aaaawww a puppy, believe me you didn’t loose out on that.

  48. Stormcat says:

    By the way gang . . . for those of you visiting NYC on a budget and wishing that you knew a great deal on lodging I’ve discovered the Ravel in LongIslandCity. The rooms are nice and very reasonably priced. Plus, Midtown Manhattan is a very short cab ride over the 59th street bridge. And LIC itself is one of the most happening places at the moment. Lots of shops and resteraunts. Hey I sound like an advertisement. Maybe somebody ought to pay me for this! 😉

  49. Stormcat says:

    No wait I think SD Guru is in Vegas (I can’t imagine why I thought he was in NY)

    • SD Guru says:

      Guys, it doesn’t matter where I’m located. Come to think of it, I don’t really exist and I’m just a figment of your imagination! :) Maybe we can plan a blog gathering at the next SA party.

      Michael, it’s not a total loss. SB’s may come and go, but you have only one boss. :)

  50. JSB says:

    Why don’t we all meet in NYC then the SDs can have a night and so can the SBs….we can all take a bite out of the big apple heheh

  51. Michael AZ Alleycat says:

    Hey SD Guru – I thought you were in California somewhere? Or was that ToughLove? I could make a NY trip if a couple of things fell in place 1. A SB managed to entice me out there (great idea! I guess they don’t call you Guru for nothing) and 2. I can get agreement from my boss aka my 11 y.o. daughter that it is ok to go.

    I have some leverage with her but I played my major card with her – got a puppy – so that I could take a couple of extended trips later this year with my SB … who is now gone. I totally lost out in all directions didn’t I?

  52. Lily says:

    It was ElegantSugar/Shoogar Shoes who told me to valet my heart.
    She was oh so right.

  53. Midwest SB says:

    Hi JSB! Love your avatar!!!

    Thanks, but I can’t take credit for it…just keeping it alive. I agree, it would be nice to have those sayings handy. Momma always said… :-)

    I’ve been on a roller coaster lately and am a little tired. Then again, I always liked roller coasters as a kid…especially the rickety wooden ones! I”m so glad it’s Friday.

  54. JSB says:

    Question: What ever happened to Gerrard?? anyone know?

    I wish Babyblonde would come back and play

  55. JSB says:

    @Midwest – you always write amazing comments…really enjoyed the valet your heart comment and agree that it is a good fit!

    I wish we had a page with all the gems we say include PJs, Sugarlicious, Valet your heart etc.

  56. Midwest SB says:

    Someone used the phrase “valet your heart” a while back and it fits very nicely here. It’s fun to take it out for a spin and show it off, but put it in park for the precious time you are together. It’s always available, but not exactly convenient.

  57. Noledgeseeker says:

    @Dandelion yes as good wake up call for them and you is to say, “with your next sugarbaby…” or “Oh but we may not be together at Christmas…etc.” or “If we are still together at Christmas…” Sometimes it stings a little but its a good grounding method. As always sprinkle with humor ie: “With your next sugar baby, remember to bring your own toothbrush” ; p or something silly like that.

    “Hell hath no fury like a Sugar Baby promised Sugar and given Splenda” – From the Seeking Arrangement book I’m reading today : )

    ~the knowledge sponge

  58. JSB says:

    @Dandelion: I am not the most experienced person, but I have been in some long term serious relationships. In my opinion the easiest way for me to keep things cool and smooth no matter how strong the feelings are is to just enjoy the moment and not get ahead of myself. If I am having a great time and enjoy someone’s company I will let them know and do things to show that they mean something to me. What I try to avoid is thinking about what things could be like in the future or talk about future plans together. I found it is better to enjoy what you have instead of fantasizing about what could be because you never know what the future will bring.

  59. Dandelion Wine says:

    (other with experience are more than welcome to chime in)

  60. Dandelion Wine says:

    SD guru, would you share your experience on how to keep things cool and smooth when the romance and passion are strong?
    Everyone probably wants that one person that gives you butterflies, makes you feel invincible and intoxicated, accepted – flaws and all, but how to enjoy all of that, whatever it may be, without making yourself too vulnerable and without letting it end in a trainwreck?

    • SD Guru says:

      @NYC SB

      I was trading out of my home… London open for currencies

      Now I understand your fascination with traders. You like to live life on the edge! I’m sure you’ll be a sugarmommy sooner than you think. :)

      @Stormcat

      Sounds like a fine idea! We just have to get him up to NYC.

      You think he’s willing to get his ass all the way out there? Maybe we need a SB volunteer to entice him… any takers? :)

      @Dandelion Wine

      would you share your experience on how to keep things cool and smooth when the romance and passion are strong?… without making yourself too vulnerable and without letting it end in a trainwreck?

      During my first 3 years in the sugar world I got emotionally involved 3 times, and I finally learned my lesson after the third time. Knowing what you should do and having the will power to actually do it are two different things. The first one ended up with me being blackmailed. The second one broke my heart and turned out to be a complete lie (Michale, sound familiar?). And the third one ended up in a train wreck. I’ll write more about those experiences in my blog.

      After those experiences I did not get emotionally involved again and I was much happier with my sugar relationships and as a result those relationships lasted longer. I think the key was to compartmentalize my emotions with the understanding that feelings of romance and passion are specific to the context of the sugar relationship and cannot be carried over to other aspects of my life. Or as Midwest SB puts it, “valet your heart”. It’s easier said than done though.

      Have a good weekend everyone!

  61. Stormcat says:

    SD guru ~ Sounds like a fine idea! We just have to get him up to NYC.

  62. JSB says:

    yay I have an avatar!! whooohooo this is a great Friday!

  63. JSB says:

    To answer the question: I am all about NSA, mutual beneficial honest relationships that should be fun, easy and pleasurable. It should be something you both look forward to, learn from, and get excited about :)

    I don’t have a time limit but I think it is important to have the best interests of both parties in mind and when it ends be grateful for the experience and meeting a new friend. I think if people are mature they can continue to keep in contact, even after an arrangement is over. Have the most fun while you can and make the most of your time together.

  64. james.m says:

    Yaz…
    Anna is on jury duty this week, defending truth, justice and the American Way.

  65. JSB says:

    Happy Friday Everyone!!

    I am uber excited bc one of my best friends from college is visiting from BC and we will be going on a wine tour this weekend!!

    @Cleo – I found an irl spot for Thursday nights!!!!!!!! When are you free???

  66. NYC SB says:

    SD Guru – I was trading out of my home… London open for currencies

  67. Viking Hybrid says:

    Hey Sugars!

    @SDGuru: I think that knowing one’s boundaries is one of the keys to making things work in most areas of life. Life experience has taught me how important it is not just to set clear goals, but to know myself well enough to know the limits of what I can and cant take, can and can’t give. There’s a difference between compromising as a means to an end, and making oneself a martyr.

    @Stormcat: LOL! My sister used to call my ex-bf “Jesus resurrected.” He was quite handsome, though, as I’m sure you are!

    @GreenEyed: Being different is what gives us character :) It’s alienating some times, but just think: if we sit down to write our autobiographies at the ripe old age of 80, boy will we have some stories to tell!

    Off to learn some programming :p Talk about a means to an end…lol.

  68. Reddamsel38 says:

    ok bye sugars gotta go to work be back later on. Everyone have a good day.

    • SD Guru says:

      @Stormcat

      It was a good discussion and I did not take any offense from what you said. One of these days you and I should get together with Alleycat to ponder the meaning of love and life over drinks!

      @Reddamsel38

      But you still dream of romance …don’t you? Everyone has thoughts and dreams of romance.

      That’s why Stormcat called me a “closet romantic”! :)

      @NYC SB

      hopefully some good moves will take place and NYC SB will make some money…

      What were you trading at 2am?

      maybe I will be buying SD Guru an Ipad

      Are you offering to be my sugarmommy? I’m not cheap and I don’t put out on the first date! 😉

  69. Reddamsel38 says:

    @ SDGuru that’s it everything back in the closet.

  70. Reddamsel38 says:

    SD Guru now I understand. THere is a fine line when it comes to attaching feelings and “romance” to a NSA arrangement. Since you’ve explained what happened to u, I see where ur coming from. But you still dream of romance …don’t you? Everyone has thoughts and dreams of romance.

  71. NC Gent says:

    Hi all – special shoutout to NY Gent — good to see you again!

    The most important part of an arrangement to me is that it has to be a genuine friendship. I have never set time limits on my sugar relationships.

    Have a great weekend everyone and may your sugar be sweet :)

  72. Reddamsel38 says:

    NYCGent why is it so bad to be considered a romantic. I mean in an arrangement situation I could see that it could probably go bad and someone can take advantage but with a seasones sd he/she should be able to pick up on that anyway right? And doesn’t being a rmantic mean that there is a chance that the other person will feel the same and be open to the possibilities taht romance has to offer?

  73. Divia12 says:

    Good morning everyone!! Don’t have time to catch up on the day I missed but quickly welcome Himmie and Green Eyed Sugar Lady!! Hope everyone has a wonderful start to their weekend!

  74. Stormcat says:

    So I’m at the checkout yesterday afternoon and out of the blue the clerk asks me if I realized that I look like Jesus. (Since Jesus is purported to have been the most beautiful man ever, I take it as a compliment.) My response though was, “Really? Does anyone actually know what Jesus looked like?” That got a laugh.

  75. Stormcat says:

    Cleo ~ nice affirmation!!!

    Well . . . if I stand up straight . . . and wear shoes . . . 6’3″ without a hat.

  76. Midwest SB says:

    BTW Lily – My feeling is PotBF #1 genuinely liked you or he would have “tapped that” without thinking twice. I’m not trying to be harsh, but just trying to see his perspective.

  77. Midwest SB says:

    Lily – you should always behave like a lady until you get to know someone better. I understand the circumstances, but much like sugar it is important to check those at the door…especially early on. You may have to move slowly or just write #1 off. PotBF #2 sounds like he may be able to take your boundless energy in stride. I’m glad you’re enjoying the non-sugar world! Are you in your house yet?

  78. Stormcat says:

    SD Guru ~ I hope I didn’t offend you, I thought I was making a light hearted taunt when I mentioned you and was just going with that flow for the rest of it.
    You said: Having passion, chemistry and connection in a NSA relationship without turning it into love and romance is the fine balance that married SD and SB’s must have. It’s not easy to do and it’s not for everyone, and it takes experience and maturity to make it work.

    I believe that of you, and respect you, that you have that kind of elegance. Well spoken!

  79. NYC SB says:

    Good morning everyone!

    It is 2am on the east coast… I am watching ex SD trade :) what fun… hopefully some good moves will take place and NYC SB will make some money… I wouldnt mind a repeat of last night at alll (maybe I will be buying SD Guru an Ipad)

    Sb-emy – aww sweetie… so sorry to hear about the SD drama… managing money and feelings (or rather the feeling of feeling used) is tough… hang in there… and you are right… you shouldnt have to ask for your allowance every week… it should be a discussion had once

  80. sb-emy says:

    thanks for the input guys, I have no idea where i’d be with this lovely community.
    xoxox

  81. Himmie says:

    @Midwest: I’m a female SB. Thanks for the welcome!

  82. Green Eyed Sugar Lady says:

    @ Everyone who welcomed me Thank you! I’m home from work and the gym, had dinner and am catching up. It’s really great to be around other people who understand. I have shared this aspect of my life with a few people close to me, but I don’t think one can really understand this life unless they live it. Lots of preconceived notions, I find.

    @ BiCentennialBaby Yes I think there is a place out there for the older (30’s and 40’s) SB’s, most definitely. Sure, the pool may be smaller, and it may take longer but it’s there. We may have some different things to offer than our younger counterparts may. Not necessarily better, just different. I wouldn’t personally feel comfortable in an arrangement with someone my age or younger anyhow. The dynamic feels wrong to me for some reason.

    I also think you may be onto something about how to keep a marriage fresh, and possibly why so many men end up looking for female companionship outside of their marriage. I’ve always been very independent but was married once myself, although I’ve been not-married for about 11 years. I was also pretty young. On the outside chance I ever get married again, I am going to remember these things and keep my own marriage fresh and exciting! :)

    @ Lily, my ex husband and I never exchanged rings, we were pretty non-traditional so I don’t have an old diamond ring. Or a new one for that matter. I’ve never had one! :)

    @ Nerdysweet and JSB I’m so glad to know I’m not the only one who feels this way. I think some of us are just cut out for different things, but it goes against the grain of what’s expected from us. Sometimes I feel lonely in the real world, especially amongst coworkers and their “normal” lives. I know I carry an aura of difference about me and the fact that I’m generally very private about my dating life kind of adds to this.

    I might have the perspective of starting this journey at a different time, culturally and do have some experience, but by no means am I am expert SB… I’ve been in and out of the bowl over the years, when I was out it was mostly due to my being busy with work, life, and trying to date “normally.” I don’t want to misrepresent myself as anything more than that. I lot of my “wisdom” comes from life experience in general, especially my mistakes. I’ve learned a lot from reading the blog posts here as well. I wish this blog had existed ten years ago!

  83. JSB says:

    Hope everyone had a great evening…wish I could catch up but I am going to call it a night!!

    Sweet dreams!

  84. Noledgeseeker says:

    @Sasha I think TravelingSB is from there.

  85. cleo says:

    true story, i was standing there tonight in my heels (that hurt because i have not found any that don’t, i have a couple of thousand dollars worth of unwearable shoes in my closet but i keep trying) and pencil skirt and little black halter top while texting a friend of mine and this group of guys got off the elevator.

    they were all wearing some kind of uniform and seemed like they wouldn’t be afraid of a hammer and i hear one of them say (in a deserted mall, bar me and they) “wow, it just doesn’t get any hotter than that” and then they walked past me (all ten of them) while loudly discussing my incredibleness…

    this made my year by the way… but the funniest part? (cause i’m 6’2 – 6’4 in heels) is as they are walking away one of them goes “nah dude, you’re not tall enough”

    the self-esteem needed that today for some reason so thanks universe and thanks random guys…
    .
    ok i’m asleep, i’ll catch up tomorrow :)

  86. Sasha says:

    Hey everyone…trying to catch up with all the blogs…whew…I step off for a day and I’m way behind.

    @Yaz do you live in NY? If so I may be heading there soon. Care to meet up sometime?

    Any sb’s in LA wanna meet up for lunch or something? I’m heading there for my birthday next month.

  87. Stormcat says:

    sb-emy ~ It sounds like you have had this arangement for quite some time. Is that true? If not then it seems that there are too many assumptions and a better relationship for you is in the future. But if this is a long time arrangement then other factors may be at play. Perhaps he has grown attached to you and he no longer consideres it NSA. On the other hand, perhaps you are not listening closely enough to his needs and he has grown frustrated.
    I think that communication that is calm and non-confrontational about both of your expectations and needs would go a long way to ease the tension in the situation.

    • SD Guru says:

      It’s interesting how my light hearted remark about being called a “closet romantic” was taken that seriously, so I’ll give a serious response. But in general, please don’t take me too seriously! :) Thanks to those who commented on the topic and I hope the following will provide some insight.

      @Stormcat

      at one time in your life you must have believed in the possibility. So you must have experienced disappointment enough times that you have become jaded. So concientiously you no longer believe that true love, in the romantic sense, is possible.

      Hey buddy, keep in mind that you and I are coming from very different perspectives in the sugar world. I’m a married family man, and you’re a very eligible bachelor. You’re free to pursue true love and romance any way you want, with sugar or not. In my case the sugar arrangement is what keeps it NSA for both parties so that we don’t have unrealistic expectations about the relationship.

      I have gotten emotionally involved more than once during my early days in the sugar world and had my heart broken. I’ll be writing about that in my blog sometime next week. The hard lesson I learned was that while “love” and “romance” gave me the warm fuzzy feeling, it’s a slippery slope that a married man should not pursue unless he is willing to leave his family (just ask John Edwards and Mark Sanders!).

      Having passion, chemistry and connection in a NSA relationship without turning it into love and romance is the fine balance that married SD and SB’s must have. It’s not easy to do and it’s not for everyone, and it takes experience and maturity to make it work. I’ve heard many stories from SB’s who said their sugar relationship was going great until the SD start to get emotionally attached and they had to end it. I’m also aware in some rare cases sugar relationships have lead to marriage. It just depends on what do the two people involved want from the relationship.

      I applaud you for being a romantic at heart and I envy you for having the freedom to do so. I know what my boundaries are and I’m sticking to them because I’ve learned my lessons the hard way.

      Now I’ll go back to my closet… :)

      @sb-emy

      I’m sorry to hear about your situation but it sounds like it’s the beginning of the end. If a SD who became emotionally attached and full of drama is not what you want in a sugar relationship, then why prolong the misery for both sides.

  88. Noledgeseeker says:

    @ sb-emy well good luck with everything. sorry I can’t follow, but I hope all works out for the best and you end up happy.

    : )

  89. sb-emy says:

    This is the beginning! SD just dropped this bomb on me, after my ex forwarded an email detailing how I was using SD for money, and that’s all I saw in him, a means to an end. This obviously hurt him, because SD saw some grain of truth in it. It being, every non response or unacceptable behaviour that is casually tied to my not being into him, because of his money, or faking it,

    Ah midwest, it’s most likely a lost cause. How are you going sweety?

    A

  90. sb-emy says:

    It only just occurred to me how damaging to my spiritual health all this relationship business is, I seriously need a break from mothering older men and expectation right now.

    Really need to concentrate on studying and not allowing all this to get to me.

    an actual NSA might be the best, given all that’s happened. Currently signed to SD for one month, see how this goes!

    A

  91. Noledgeseeker says:

    @ sb-emy I feel like I just dropped into the middle of a conversation. I’m trying to follow but I’m really having trouble. Can you start from the beginning maybe?

    ~confused

  92. sb-emy says:

    hey guys,

    Sorry to be so all over the place. I typed it as messages were received, and he had the gall to continue this conversation via text. He came to Sydney to see me, and kept the evening free, and throughout the night he emphasised that he had to do twice the amount of work, his partner was piling on the work because she knew he had nothing better to do. He knew I had a curfew, and was hoping for “more” afterwards.

    P.S. how did you know i’m in Sydney? Haha, this narrows things further…

    To desribe sequentially, my sugar daddy has sent me a text late last night indicating at how upset he was at me for leaving so abruptly, and that i had given the impression i couldn’t wait to get away from him. And that these doubts were cemented by the fact of going through previous text messages, and emails to check if he “wasn’t going paranoid”.
    He did tell me he was having a bad week, but having to pile all this shit on me is unacceptable. I’m dealing with a break up of a long term relationship as well, and if travelling in between states is SO hard then maybe he should find someone else. The main complaint is that is that he’d “rather be alone, than be with someone who’d rather be somewhere else”.
    I tried reassuring him, but I really shouldn’t have to. Everything is NSA, and I really shouldn’t have to ASK for my allowance every week.

    I believe I show enough affection to meet his demands, and he is very demanding, texts me every day knowing we both have full schedules. I can’t handle someone who tells me to “pull something out of a hat” to be back on their good side, because I couldn’t possibly have screwed him over so bad.

    A

  93. aspiring-doc says:

    @ eb emy- wow how confusing.

    Sounds like a buiildup of events and maybe miscommunication. If it was a NSA arrangement- why was he annoyed you had a bf? equally why would u be annoyed he was with someone else? sounds like he had an assumption of exlsuivity in the realationship? SO he was upset at the fact you were sleeping with someone at the same time as him, so thought hed tell you he was doing the same. (hence the comment about even moral ground)

    Did he just go to sydey to see you for dinner or did you spend the whole day together? His comment about lack of passion may suggest something? if it was just dinner- maybe he was hoping for more afterward? did he know beforehand u had a curfew? :)

  94. Noledgeseeker says:

    @stormy crystal

  95. Stormcat says:

    About my avatar? I feel like I have multiple personality disorder. When I am on the blog from my desktop computer I get my head shot from when I was out kayaking but when I’m blogging from my laptop my avatar shows up as the photo of a benetoite crystal. So what does everyone else see? Does it keep switching from your perspective as well.

  96. Stormcat says:

    sb-emy ~ it seems that both you and your SD are quite upset. But your description here of the interactions leading up to this moment are very confusing. Perhaps you can be a little more clear if you describe the events more sequentially. What happened first, then next after that etc. Describing it to us, in that way may also allow you to see it more clearly yourself.

  97. Midwest SB says:

    sb-emy – It sounds like a whole lotta drama. NEXT sounds good! Open communication could help some of that, but it looks like this is beyond hope.

    NYGent & SD Guru – I completely understand why you say that, but I still believe that opening your heart (even if it’s just a little) is not a bad thing. It becomes too transactional otherwise. Besides, why be something your not.

  98. sb-emy says:

    p.s. yes it was a big deal for him to come to my state, but if he thinks something as small as having to leave to make my curfew was simply not a compromise then no thanks/

  99. sb-emy says:

    OK. wtf

    It only just occurred to me what SD has said, i.e. that I had to “pull something out of a hat”, or do something miraculous for him to come back to my state again.

    yeah, i think the answer’s obvious. NEXT

  100. NYGent says:

    Reddamsel: SD Guru is right about the “romantic” label being something for an SD to avoid. I had more than one pot SB observe that I was “very romantic” and it was not meant as a compliment!

  101. sb-emy says:

    Had a harrowing conversation with my Sd today, it was by text but the gist of it was:

    SD: I think we are on even (moral high) ground. I haven’t been completely honest with you, and earlier in our relations I sought the intimacy of two women who contacted me from SeekingArrangement. I was upset at the time that there was passion lacking in our relationship. My wife found out, and after going through my email, it was ironic and the conversations between us were the least discriminating

    me: I didnt realise you were so upset at me at the time! I can’t read minds. But then again, we do have a no strings attached thing going on, so it’s better you don’t tell me about THOSE things because they are at the same time upsetting to me. if you find that you couldn’t talk about that to me, then that is rather :/

    SD: also the email your ex sent me regarding how you were seeing me at the same time you were in a long term relationship, had some grain of truth to it I believe. but then i’m willing to put that past behind us, and turn over a new leaf.

    then last night he gets shitty at me for leaving, according to him it was “thanks for dinner. bye” time thing, and it upset him because of all the effort of going up to Sydney to see me (no other work related reason), his wife being suspicious and my leaving so abruptly.

    i try to cal him down a bit but he’s still very upset and quote “sorry for being a drama queen, but i feel as if you couldnt wait to get away from me, and that your heart wasn’t in it”

    what now ladies?

  102. Noledgeseeker says:

    that is my avatar…. isn’t it awesome! hahahaha

  103. Midwest SB says:

    Those responses were from the last blog, but got lost in the transition.

  104. Midwest SB says:

    Bettyblue – my suggestion for PotSD is to turn down the $500 pay for play offer and instead suggest you meet for dinner in a public place. If you have chemistry, you plan another date and set the expectation that the arrangement needs to be agreed upon first. If he balks, he was wasting your time. If he’s new, refer him to the blog! I think you are setting yourself up to be used and accepting a small gift for one night of intimacy to test for chemistry is unacceptable in my book. Chemistry is obvious without the intimacy.

    Sassy Girl – It sounds like you are taking a long, hard look at what you are willing to settle for here. I can share that the best looking SDs can be the worst in other areas such as respect, intimacy and integrity. The average looking SDs can be great lovers, mentors and have characteristics you find adorable. If you decide to stay, convince yourself to disregard looks and go out with a gentleman if you connect via phone and e-mail; if he makes you laugh; if he shows respect and if he understands the nature of arrangements. I’ve stopped asking for pictures and have always been pleasantly surprised. Look below the surface. If it doesn’t work, then at least you can say you tried.

    Best of luck!

  105. aspiring-doc says:

    @Michael- Note earlier comment re swallowing= total naivety- i am genuinely learning the physiology of the swallow- no sexual innuendo :)
    Im not sure how sexy it is to point out how someone eats- did you know that…. 😛

    otherwise too much blogging for me to catchup on! :)

    have a lovely day xx

  106. Reddamsel38 says:

    G’night sugars. ANd all the romantics.:0

  107. Reddamsel38 says:

    @yaz why doesn’t SD want to admit to being a romantic? I think that’s sexy.

    @SD Guru why don’t you want to be known as a romantic? Do you think it implies something?

  108. Reddamsel38 says:

    @noledgeseeker what is wrong? where is your avatar?

    cleo and Stormy sittin a tree? AAAAAAAAAAAwwwwwwwwwww

    And what happened to the topic of the post? somebody changed it around.

  109. Midwest SB says:

    Welcome Himmie! A you a male or female SB?

    Noledgeseeker – what in the world is your avatar? :-)

  110. Midwest SB says:

    Stormcat – Great men seldom live to realize their contribution. Instead, relish the moments that take your breath away and keep your inventive passion alive. I love your hopelessly romantic abandon in all you do…what a great mind!

    Welcome Green-Eyed SB – I loved your post!

    Great conversations!

    As for the questions…there isn’t much I can add that hasn’t been said. Except – Be true and realistic to yourself.

  111. Himmie says:

    I’m new to Sugarland, but I know that I want a upfront, mutually beneficial relationship. I’m not looking for sex; I just want an older man to talk to and take care of.

  112. Noledgeseeker says:

    can you hear me now

  113. Stormcat says:

    OK, gotta go! Dinner, wine, and great company awaits.

  114. Stormcat says:

    That said – once lightning strikes, the effect never leaves.

  115. Stormcat says:

    Cleo ~ I’ve read your post about 30 times now (of course) and the very last statement is the most astute. It takes only about 1 millisecond in the actual physical presence of the other to know if there is something there, everything after that is confirmation.

  116. Noledgeseeker says:

    rofl I’m working on it

  117. yaz says:

    A big ass book about something???

  118. yaz says:

    Noledgeseeker~ I see BIG….ASS…and BOOK?

  119. Stormcat says:

    Noledgeseeker ~ yay, You got it! What is it?

  120. yaz says:

    SD Guru ~ You have been exposed! Ha

  121. Noledgeseeker says:

    damn looks dumb

  122. Noledgeseeker says:

    abracadabra!

  123. Stormcat says:

    Cleo ~ Estepona is more than 500 miles from Barcelona. I’m not saying it’s not do-able but it might be more than a day trip!

  124. Noledgeseeker says:

    avatar now?

  125. JSB says:

    @SDG – looks like Stormcat brings up some good points

    Nothing wrong with being a romantic, I bet everyone is to some extent

  126. Stormcat says:

    oh f**k: consciously

  127. Stormcat says:

    sd guru ~ not concientiously, conciously

  128. Stormcat says:

    Cleo ~ yahoo stormcatgl 😉 😉 😉

  129. Stormcat says:

    SD Guru ~ Sir, It was I!
    The evidence: You once told me, in essence, that I should avoid the temptation to believe that one of these beautiful women could transition into a real love because it was an emotional roller coaster that would leave me disappointed at best and most likely bitter. At the time you said that you knew by experience! That must mean that at one time in your life you must have believed in the possibility. So you must have experienced disappointment enough times that you have become jaded. So concientiously you no longer believe that true love, in the romantic sense, is possible. But I know that conscious logic can never negate subconscious belief. Therefore you are a romantic but as an emotional defense you deny it.

  130. JSB says:

    Why won’t the image show?? grrrr ahhh well

  131. JSB says:

    @Cleo – thnx for the avatar tips!! I added one – yay!

    @Green Eyed – Great post and welcome!! When you wrote:

    “I’ve been single by choice for many years, very independent, and everytime I dip my toes in the waters of “traditional” dating, I feel afraid of being smothered or afraid the other person is going to want more of me than I can give (experience has shown this to be true.) At the same time I am great girlfriend material- as long as it’s part time and I get to have my own life too!”

    – I could not have written it better, I feel the exact same way, looking forward to more of your posts!

    Wish I could write more but I am heading out and will write more later…I am having doubts with my sd but I won’t get into the details just yet.

    Happy Thursday Evening…wish I could be w/ Cleo doing some irl hunting tonight!

  132. Noledgeseeker says:

    avatar?

  133. Noledgeseeker says:

    Cleo and Stormy sittin’ in a tree

    hehehe, I’m on the edge of my seat like I’m watching an excellent movie, mindlessly eating popcorn, heart full of anticipation as to the next development in the story…

    • SD Guru says:

      Did somebody call me a “closet romantic”? I want to see some proof before being accused of such a thing! I wonder what else is in my closet? :)

  134. cleo says:

    yaz: i figured you actually wanted to know so i told you :)

    man my comment is messy – lol

  135. yaz says:

    Cleo ~ Thanks! haha I am horrible at correctly translating stuff in English

  136. cleo says:

    Stormcat: i say yes! i want to find a sandal maker in estepona though, can we do a little day trip? my mother got me this pair of shoes once by describing my feet in relation to hers.

    i wore them for ten years before they finally died (leather snapped, sole was still solid) and i wish for another pair

    he stamped his mark into them, i think i could find him :)
    .
    BB: i can’t speak for storm, if you wish to be his alternate friend for wondrous adventures that live forever in ones brain as little nuggets to be forever enjoyed and polished? who am i to stop him?
    .
    Stormcat: what about all the asexual types? many monks have made enormous contributions to the world and i do believe that some folks just drop themselves into their passion and never do anything else. perhaps their fire would burn brighter if they left the house, who is to know it?

    my nana said you should marry someone who brings out the best in you … i’ve added the corollary “and that makes you want to be better” and that may be it for those couples whose work was in similar disciplines. they ‘excited’ each other like molecules in close proximity…
    .
    Noledgeseeker: it would certainly be lovely to have such golden moments no?

    as for my sex life, all i can do is shake my head and laugh.
    .
    Stormcat: your reply on my behalf was eloquent and thoughtful as usual. if i have indeed left such an impression with you i can only be but flattered and reply that in truth, you have made a similar impression sir.

    it does all boil down to that mystical attraction doesn’t it? it’s there or it isn’t… in greater and lesser degrees among many people. i certainly find that expecting to like someone influences it… and that when two people form a liking for each other in such a forum they are usually always good friends even if nothing more comes of a meeting.

    that said, is there anything sexier than passion in a smart person who likes themselves?
    .
    Yaz: poursuivre is chase rather than catch but yes
    .
    Noledgeseeker: i met one once, he got away… and frankly probably liked pills more than anything else. god he was hot though. rich and cute and whip smart and funny… i blowed it and it’s sad because i like *him* (still wonder about him on occasion three years later)

    as for my tail, it is my understanding that the gentleman in question is currently otherwise occupied :)
    .
    with regard to romance and passion? who wouldn’t reach for it with both hands if it was real? that said, why not take your time and be sure? if it’s real it won’t be hurt by patience and thought.

  137. Lily says:

    Laundry ? Yawn. I want to dream of finding my 1 true love…. Who would also spoil me. 😉

  138. thinking about catching up but I fear I’ve missed too much.. I guess my request for an iphone app never went through :(

  139. Noledgeseeker says:

    lol Stormcat. Girls is it getting a little steamy in here? Think we could all use a cold shower before we all fall for Stormy and his romantic passionate words. hehe…yes back down to earth and laundry.

    ~me

  140. Lily says:

    Bye, Sentimental Storm!

  141. Noledgeseeker says:

    oh my Cleo careful, you have a romantic on your tail! And I am green with envy : p (In a good way : ) )

    I long for passion. Sad most of the passionate ones are “artists” with no job and no sugar to give ; p. I dated my share of passionates back in the day and none of them were worth a flip out of their own zone. To have both? Success and passion? Is there such a man?
    *le sigh*

    ~me

  142. Lily says:

    I’ve never been with a man who plotted surprises for me or bought gifts for me, except when I was a student and they were pretty much throwaway items neither valuable in an objective sense nor meaningful to me as a thoughtful token.

    Maybe that’s why sugar relationships were such a nice change of pace. I waited 30 years to be spoiled, after all!

  143. Stormcat says:

    Wow! I need to come back down to earth! 😉

    I think I’ll go do some work and calm down!

    Later Gang.

  144. Lily says:

    Hi Yaz!

    Stormcat, you are the kind of romantic that I hope for in this life!!

  145. Stormcat says:

    Lily ~ The ring is a given! A thousand rings and a myriad of gifts and suprises! And overwhelmingly exquisite sex that synergistically transends either’s imagination. And a million admirers, trying to understand what it is and why they don’t have it!

  146. yaz says:

    SD guru is a closet romantic? lol

  147. Stormcat says:

    B Baby ~ right on! You say it so well and it is the essence of how I feel too. (And, I’m not passing judgement on the other forms of arrangements. They are mostly all beautiful and acceptable as long as they are chosen without duress. To me even prostetituion, if volentary and deliberate, is fine, sometimes even beautiful, it is just not something that I would find satisfying personally.) But as everyone here knows I, like you, am a romantic at heart (Actually, I think most everyone else here is the same even though some of the blogers like SD Guru are closet romantics) so I’m looking for the passionate arrangement. The one that lasts a lifetime and inspires my sensibality to lose control. The dangerous one, that assures me that I am alive in the world and participating in life at its fullest.

  148. yaz says:

    You are coming all the way from Chicago? Nice!

  149. yaz says:

    Hi lily! :)

    SS ~ Email me at yaz1033 at the Y place (Yahoo)

  150. @Lily,

    I actually had mine remounted for a sweet 16 ring for my daughter! Guard and engagement diamond, new setting. The stones were bought by her father and should go to her as a family piece. He approved as well!

  151. Lily says:

    I wonder what all ye divorced gals do with your old diamond rings??

  152. awesome! whats your profile code? I look forward to meeting you! Do you live in NY?

  153. yaz says:

    Soaring Sparrow ~ Yes I will be :)

  154. Lily says:

    Stormcat I love your definition. But if I had that, I’d also want a ring.

  155. yaz says:

    Haha let me know when you invent a way to catch two rabbits at the same time ( given that they are running in opposite directions)! 😉

    And yes, I do find inventing to be very seductive!

  156. Stormcat says:

    Knowledgeseeker ~ I’m a very poor chain yanker. However, you are right. It was inappropriate to make such an offer in a public forum. If there is no attraction on her part, such an offor could make her feel very uncomfortable. And making it as if it were all in playful fun is simply a hedge to defend ones ego. But since you have called me on it, I have never met Cleo in person but from her profile, her lifestyle, and her blog personality, I find myself drawn toward her as beautiful and desirable. So while the offer was somewhat provocative and could have been interpreted as jest, I assure you that, in private, there would be no such undertone.

  157. @Stormcat,

    Oh I do like the latter definition, I am a Victorian girl at heart (not in prudery, but rather the romanticism of the era) and another allegory to the consuming and fascinating love you speak of is the unrequited love of the knightly times. Perhaps it is because it IS unconventional/unconsummated in the traditional way (ie by marriage, not intimacy…) that sugar relationships are so well, spicy in comparison!

    and yes, without passion, our lives become mundane. One of my favorite quotes (don’t know the author) is to the effect of:

    “If you must sweep the streets in your occupation in life, do it such that even Michealangelo and the angels of Heaven weep at your passing, for never has there been such a streetsweeper as you….” .

    Nothing is too lowly for the artist to infuse it with beauty and purpose if he is called to his work.

    I am of the opinion the artist comes before his muse, because talent must be there to begin with. You can be told you are a genius (or beautiful) a 1,000 times but if YOU don’t believe it, it will never be genuine. However once that is there, a muse or lover becomes the INSPIRATION for your opus, your life’s finest work.

    similar to a diamond, the beauty of the rock is always there, buried in carbon, but it takes the skilled jewelers’ hand to turn it into the brilliant, mutli-faceted stone that takes our breath away. It takes both potential (artist) and refinement (muse)–as well as much pressure and time—to turn a lump of coal into the glittering diamond that takes our breath away to behold. just my 2 cents! :)

  158. Hey OC!

    Thanks Yaz! Are you gonna be at the party??

  159. Stormcat says:

    Yaz ~ Oh I like that challenge! Invent a way to catch two rabbits simultaneously.
    But seriously, don’t you think that we are congruent in our thinking. Isn’t a passion, such as inventing, very seductive? And don’t you believe, as I do, that the partnerships that are founded in passion spill over into the life works of the participants. Look at the lives of the great people who we all admire and are essentially houshold nomes. Weren’t they all passionate people sometimes to a fault!
    I think I don’t view sugar dating in the NSA, No-Drama, mutually benificial, meet once a week, business arrangement that seems to be the norm. I Think of it as exciting, excusive, somewhat secret, sociatially forbidden, a little dangerous, and a foray into the world of relationships only experienced by adventureres and royalty.

  160. yaz says:

    Stormy~ Email sent. Thanks!

  161. Noledgeseeker says:

    I know, when someone thinks I’m awesome, I tend to be more awesome. But I think that is the way of the follower. The leader is already awesome and may only be tragically distracted by love for another…thoughts?

    @Cleo poor Cleo, : ( But take Stormcat up on his offer! That is unless he was just yanking your chain, which would not be very nice Stormy.

    : )

    ~me

  162. yaz says:

    Stormy~ I am inclined to think that your quest for greatness is your barrier to finding passionate love. See, men succeed in whatever they want to achieve if and only if they are passionate about it. You start off from scratch, make millions and grow your empire because your have a passion for what you do and never quit until you reach your goals. That’s why they say winners are not quitters. If you were to transfer that same energy and passion into finding your muse, your passionate love, that woman that makes your heart skip a beat every time you see her then you will be focusing less and less time on your inventions.
    There is a french saying that goes ” On ne peut pas poursuivre deux lievres a la fois”
    Meaning, it is impossible to catch two rabbits at the same time. ( French speakers, did I translate that the right way?? lol)
    Do you want to keep on trying to produce that one invention that will make you stop and stay “Hey, I am genius after all” or do you want to look for that one person that will make you FEEL like a genius over and over again? The choice is yours. Remember, sometimes our greatest achievements mean nothing to us until that one person says ” I cannot believe you did that! You are my hero!” The respect and admiration in her eyes will make you feel like SUPERMAN and, interestingly enough, will drive you even more to excel at what you do!!! :)
    My thoughts…

  163. Stormcat says:

    OK all ~ Here is my latest pondering: I would love your thoughts.

    I think about all the greatest contributors to humanity (musicians, artists, statesmen, scientists, industrialists, inventors, authors, etc.) and am starting to realize that although it’s not the rule, essentially all of them passionately loved someone. It makes everyone feel that their successes was somehow linked to the presence of that person in their life. But is that true? A) Was the person successful because of the influence of their beloved? Or, B) was the beloved the seducer and present in his/her life only because of the persons success? Is is A, B, Both A & B, Neither A nor B, or All of the above. Well that is a redundant question. Obviously the answer is any of the above but taken on a case by case basis. Madame Curie would have never made her great discovery without her lifelong partner and husband. Yet Igor Stravinski had already written his best known works before he abandoned his wife and family for the siren that occupied most of his later life.

    I ask this because I am considering my own life and potential for greatness. I know that I am a genius inventor, because so many people have told me that I am. Yet I have produced nothing that satisfies my expectation of that label so that I can’t yet believe it of myself. So is the element that I’m missing a muse? A passionsate love for which the desire, to be with her, so consumes me that it motivates me to reach deep into my reserves and produce greatness in order to simply please her enough that she will reciprocate that desire. Or is my search for such a muse the very distraction that keeps greatness elusory? Or, of course, perhaps it’s my quest for greatness that is the barrier to finding passionate love. Wouldn’t that be ironic!

  164. Stormcat says:

    Yaz ~ Yahoo Stormcatgl, I can give you her e-mjail addy.

    B Baby ~ Temptations Temptations Temptations!!! or is it Frustrations Frustrations Frustrations! So many SBs so little sugar to spread! :)

  165. Ah, Cleo you lucky girl…I’d take Stormcat on your off weekends!

    I’d be DELIGHTED to find a SD who wants to go back with me to the Butterfly Gardens and Dolphin swimming in Isla Roatan in Honduras or hit 7 Mile Island on Grand Cayman! I love the Carribean…to me there’s nothing more amazing than the waters off of Mexico and the islands. Stomping through Aztec & Mayan ruins in Belize & Mexico was probably the most amazing trip ever in my life so far.

    Egypt and Buenos Aries are on my “bucket list”, also hitting the Mediterranian, esp if by cruise ship. There are so many amazing places in this world to see.

    I’d be happy to see NYC once too…closest I’ve ever been is across the river in Trenton NJ…somehow I think that’s NOT the NY experience everyone raves about!

  166. yaz says:

    I will ask once again……Anna Molly where are youuuuuuuuuuuuu?

  167. yaz says:

    Stormy ~ Will do :)
    Have a lot going on that weekend so I will def have a great time!! :)

  168. Noledgeseeker says:

    @GreenEyedSugarLady welcome!

    @NerdySweet you are new, yes? you posted an ignored intro last blog or so, I’ve been meaning to say… Welcome! : )

    …coffee…unblur my eyes…

  169. Stormcat says:

    Yaz, SS ~ I’m sure you two will have a great time. Give my regards to Stephan, and NYCSB!

  170. yaz says:

    Stormy ~ Yup!

  171. Stormcat says:

    Buttons on the butt . . . No way am I going anywhere with that!

  172. Stormcat says:

    Lily ~ I think you are perfectly positioned to start a whole new therapy modality. Call it Sugaholics Anonymous! Without your therapy there can never be an ordinary traditional relationship.

  173. Stormcat says:

    Yaz ~ Monday is impossible, Damn Damn Damn! I’ll have to catch the next one. Are you going to be there?

  174. Lily says:

    Greetings from my so- called life & my sugarless summer!!!

    Muse – nice to see you on here!

    More than once a week is not really a sugar relationship, it’s like ….being together. Horrible, if you ask me! The flames of passion need plenty of oxygen to stay burning bright. 2-3 times per month, but for a day or two each time, would be nice. Every other weekend, but separate lives otherwise…..bliss. I’ve had one that I only ever saw 4 times, in half a year, but it was quality, if not quantity!

    I’m considering having a traditional relationship! Sugar habits die hard, though….

  175. yaz says:

    Stormy~ The party is on Monday and yes you can still get tickets I think.

  176. Reddamsel38 says:

    *gotta

  177. Stormcat says:

    OC your too funny, HH lol. Do you think he ever wears the kind with the built in slippers?

    • I think I found the answer to what some are posting as “PJ“, not Hugh Heffner at all!
      No feety jammies for that, yes Stormcat the ones with the feet and buttons on the butt.

  178. Reddamsel38 says:

    Goota go to work bye sugars later ;p

  179. Reddamsel38 says:

    OOOps forgot my manners for a moment. Hello to all. Notice that the guys aren’t here right now. Who was first? It’s Alleycat.lol :)

  180. Stormcat says:

    That’s what I get for posting without updating . . .

    Lily ~ Don’t worry darling, I’ll always be in love with you!

    Allycat ~ Along with the position of 1st comes some responsability – You at least have to address the topic! (even if it is in your second post)

  181. Stormcat says:

    Hey SS ~ good to see you! Damn I forgot about the party, maybe it’s not too late to get tickets. When is it again?

    Green Eyed Sugar Lady ~ Welcome! Good post! I too indulge in the long blog and love reading them esp. when it’s a story or, as in your case, an interesting history/experience with a fresh perspective.

    Oh Cleo ~ I’d like to volunteer to be your occasional weekend SD. Lets see . . . Rendezvous at exotic destinations, sample the local color, then disappear back into reality with the memories and anticipation of the next experience. What do you think about Egypt in Nov, Buenos Aires in late Jan, and Barcelona in the Spring?

  182. yaz says:

    Soaring Sparrow~ Your pics are beautiful!

    Hi everyone :)

  183. Reddamsel38 says:

    @ Green eyes thanks so much for that. I hope that we hear more from you soon. Your wisdom and experience will be greatly appreciated and welcomed.

  184. Hi guys! I know its been forrrreeeevvver since I’ve posted. Hope everyones having an amazing summer. This is totally off topic but I just want to say that I have am soooooooooooooo excited to finally be going to an SA party…If anyone is going, hit me up! I’d love to meet some sugars from the blog in person!

    xo!

  185. Reddamsel38 says:

    Thanks Cleo for the avatar info!

  186. Reddamsel38 says:

    Thank goodness for a new topic!

  187. cleo says:

    i would be happy with one SD or two but i wouldn’t lie to them about it. i often think a one or two afternoons a week with one guy and the occasional weekend away with another would be lovely

    exclusivity is easy for me though so i don’t object to it, just sorta like the idea of one local and one distant SD…

    that said, you have to have one before you know what you like right? so i know the SD of my dreams but don’t expect to meet him anymore… frankly i hang out here cause i like y’all but expect to find a sugar daddy? i feel like i’m as like to get struck by lightning unfortunately.

    at least i’m getting used to celibacy, it really does get easier after the first six months…

  188. Reddamsel38 says:

    For me definitely upfront and mutually beneficial. Well, you will definitely find out about the mutually beneficial part by being upfront right? Being a new sb I think that would be a no brainer here. I think the steps of how to do this is where most new sbs gets tripped up about though. That’s why is so good to have this blog with seasoned sbs and sds. Finger lickin good. ( I know corny joke ;p). But seriously, I don’t think there is any other way to approach this sitiuation unless you are upfront and know what you are looking for in an arrangement. Same goes for the sd. I think being upfront trumps everything else. Ask the right questions you can cover all those things in one shot.

  189. ElegantSugarBaby says:

    My ideal friendship/mentorship/companionship?!

    The most important aspect of such a friendship is being upfront, honest and respectful. I prefer a 3 month + arrangement. I prefer NSA of course, but prefer my mentor/benefactor/SD to have only one SB. In this instance we can fully devote our energy and time to one another for what it is! As far as married/single/divorced/baggage as long as it is put out there in the beginning I am ok about most circumstances.

    It usually only takes a few emails to decide if we are on the same level.
    If we aren’t we part ways if we are, I usually try and arrange a face to face soon, as to not waste more time…

    I believe in order for this type of friendship to work, all expectations and or requests be laid on the table. If you want an allowance, say it, don’t hope for it. If you want shopping, or trips ask for them.. Don’t assume… Leave nothing in the wind, except your naked skin against each other.. :)

    I hope everyone is having a fun filled SUGAR week/weekend!!

  190. NerdySweet says:

    @GreenEyedSugarLady,

    Your experience with traditional dating sounds very much like mine. I used to think I was too independent or something and not “made” for a relationship. But now that I’ve discovered the sugar world, I think this is it!

    As for the questions of the day: No-Strings-Attached, Mutually Beneficial, and being upfront are the most important to me. I suppose in terms of length, 6 mos. would be nice, but leaving things open allows a bit of flexibility, in that both sides could find it’s not the best arrangement and need to call it quits, or that it’s really wonderful and could go on indefinitely.

    I’m still fresh in the game, so who knows—maybe I’ll become jaded and think short-term is best.

  191. Lily says:

    I hope everyone is having a lovely Thursday!!!

  192. @GreenEyedSugarLady,

    Nice to hear from you…the fact you started at 31 and are now in your 40’s gives me a lot of hope (mid 30’s here and married). If nothing else, I’ve learned a lot of things regarding what men find desirable from this blog, and its opened up a lot of dialogue at home.

    I sort of wish I had heard of this world before I was married…1st time at 18, last time within a year of my divorce. I grew up in a world where marriage at 16 was pretty much the norm. I started dating at 13, mom was married at 16 herself, had me at 19, I had my kidlet just barely out of my teens. I really never knew, ignorant as it is, that you didn’t marry the sweet boy who “claimed” you as his since you were childhood friends. Thats exactly what all my friends and family did.

    Sadly, a lot of why the divorce rate is over 50% or so is the fact that perhaps rather than make it harder to divorce, we should make it harder to MARRY! How many men (and women) are on SA because they made that decision hastily and worse, find themselves in a relationship with no intimacy?? Reading all I have has really opened my eyes not only to the fact we as women aren’t forced to just accept whoever “picks” us, but that equally important, we need to be aware of how important intimacy is to the men in our lives. So communication is key in ANY relationship, whether in the sugar bowl or out of it. But before you can communicate, you have to honestly know what your options are and what YOU are willing to give in a relationship, NSA or otherwise, before you’ll have any success.

    I can say this with conviction because I’ve been both married and divorced, and the very things that you might think would have strengthened my marriage now such as my family’s influence, my friends’ opinions, church, etc? They all I learned served to strangle where my DH was coming from. Realizing what his needs were (more intimacy, a wife who is more confident and not clinging on his every thought or crying about it, and a less selfish attitude) and mine were (more freedom, self-confidence and
    the ability to pursue the things in life I want…even if they are just THINGS) has done more to keep us together than any marriage counseling we had.

    Truth to tell, I think women like GreenEyes are in demand emotionally, esp in NSA arrangements…because as women many of us tend to get too wrapped up in who we are for a man and not remember to look good/develop/improve for OURSELVES as well. If I don’t want to be me, why would you want to be WITH me after all? No man as I learned from my own other half, wants to have the burden of being the identity of the relationship. It gets to be a drag. True, the fun of new love/dating wears off in the first 1-2 years, often sooner….but if we would continue to look at ourselves as others see us and keep ourselves fresh, interesting, attractive and considerate of others, I think all our relationships, sugar or otherwise, would last longer and be a lot sweeter!

    Two books I’ve read recently I highly recommend are Why Men Love Bitches by Sherry Argov and SugarBabe by Holly Hill. Both go into the very dynamic Green Eyes discusses above about being first and foremost your own woman and how that attracts men. The 2nd book focuses a lot on why married men often seek babies and should be required reading for any married woman who wants to keep it that way IMHO.

    Wish I was in the Pacific Northwest to meet up, but I’m an east coaster I’m afraid. I love the fact we have a Midwest baby and those from states all over on this board though!

  193. Green Eyed Sugar Lady says:

    Hi Sugars,

    I’ve fairly new to SA and the blog, although not entirely new to the sugar world. Since I am in the midst of sugar searching right now, I am finding the blog to be a great resource and thought I should introduce myself.

    My first foray into the sugar world was ten years ago (I was 31 at the time), this was back in the days before SD/SB sites existed (I think), or even Craigslist, so the only way to advertise one’s needs was through carefully worded ads in the local alternative newsweekly. Even though this was not as convenient, in comparison to the internet, the percentage of SD’s who “got it” and were seeking the same thing was much higher. In fact, I don’t ever remember being offered money for sex….. these men were looking for mistresses. So most of the “meet and greets” were about screening for compatibility, nothing else. My biggest problem back then was finding the time to schedule first meetings as the demand was so high. I miss those days! In the interim between then and now I have had my share of experiences, not all bad, but definitely not all good either. I’ve learned a lot from both.

    I am finding this blog to be a wonderful pool of sanity in the ocean of PJ’s, one-line emails, pic collectors, etc. etc. I also am disturbed to see so many ladies (mostly on CL) advertising themselves as “sugarbabies” when it’s clear they are just looking for someone to sleep with once or twice because they are behind on rent. Not that I don’t feel for their situation but that’s not what it’s all about, in my opinion. I also see how many of these ladies are blatant about how desperate they are, and cringe- that’s an open invitation to get taken advantage of.

    Anyhow, I’ve always felt kind of like I was born to this world… I’ve been single by choice for many years, very independent, and everytime I dip my toes in the waters of “traditional” dating, I feel afraid of being smothered or afraid the other person is going to want more of me than I can give (experience has shown this to be true.) At the same time I am great girlfriend material- as long as it’s part time and I get to have my own life too!

    I have been blessed with the ability to really see the best qualities in others, and that’s a springboard for a great connection. I say this because while not every SD may not be the most handsome or “hot’ guy, there are often other great qualities they may have that outshine these things and are equally attractive as looks. I think that’s the key to enjoying the time spent together (well, one of them!) I am sure many SB’s understand what I mean.

    So this intro doesn’t turn into a mini-novel, although it may be too late, back to the questions at hand:

    NSA: My first SD wanted exclusivity, that was part of the deal. He was married although not intimate with his wife and was staying married because they still had children at home. At the time I was fine with this. My preference is for NSA though, especially in the beginning, but at the same time I wouldn’t be seeing/sleeping with many, or any, other people. I’d just like to know that I could if I wanted to without feeling guilty. If I have an ongoing arrangement with a SD, I’m giving much of myself, energy, free time to them, so i wouldn’t feel inclined to seek out anything else anyhow. If exclusivity was mutually agreed upon I would honor that- but it would need to be the right situation to go there in the first place.

    Mutually Beneficial- yes!

    Short Term- whatever works best for both… I’d say six months are less is fine, but if both people are happy and want to continue for longer, why not?

    Upfront- yes, especially about the most important things/dealbreakers. Some things may not come up during the initial correspondence or first meeting and may be addressed over time.

    Sorry this was so long! My last question is are there any SB’s here in the Pacific Northwest? I’d love to correspond and possibly get together if so.

    Thanks!

  194. Noir says:

    Thank you Cleo

    Good morning to all the sugars out there!!!!

  195. cleo says:

    go to gravatar dot com and regirster the email address you post with with a photo

  196. Noir says:

    I know this is off subject, but how do I get a photo to show in the top corner of my post?

  197. Noir says:

    I agree with Bicentennial Baby and SugaBeckha. Being upfront is what’s most essential to me. I value being upfront from the very beginning, so that both parties know what to expect and there won’t be any confusion during the course of the relationship. Being upfront extends to allowance, boundaries, exclusivity, expectations, etc. I believe relationships (no matter what kind) tend to be better off when everyone can communicate openly and honestly about every aspect of their relationship.

  198. Noledgeseeker says:

    Evening Sugars, that is Goodnight. See you in the morn.

    ~me

  199. SugaBeckha says:

    oh and I was second yeahhhhhh go me go me go go go me lol sorry bein silly a little too much mojito :)

  200. SugaBeckha says:

    I feel the same way I would like it to be upfront, and NSA,but at the same time I want to know there is a connection and even after the arrangement is over we can still keep in contact as friends. Is that wrong for me to want that?

    I would like to know that the SD won’t make me feel guilty about what I am asking for.

    I had tried to have a arrangement similiar but not quite a sugar relationship, he was older and I met him on another site, but he started to become emotionally attached and I was upfront with him from the start.

    How do you discuss it, and when? I think I am jumping the gun a little because I haven’t even received an email….. LOL

    so it goes

    Kisses Ksess

    Beckha

  201. ok, to the topic at hand….

    Definitely UPFRONT. I think we’ve all read some horror stories about those who keep secrets but worse, don’t understand its not always that one has to be exclusive but the MISREPRESENTATION is the issue. If a pot SD wants a single SB, or one without kids, or a SB wants her pot to be single and not married himself…that’s all stuff that everyone should put out there to BEGIN WITH.

    Somewhere in the SA book I read one of those funny profiles that said “there….that saved about four thousand, three hundred and seventy some conversations” and I realy think that’s the case. Sure it might limit the initial pool a little bit but then you get the ones who really will come through left to contact and I bet the success rate is much higher.

    NSA…I would think that’s normal, no demands on the other, but a lot of people seem to just kind of assume things are exclusive and don’t take the time to discuss what exclusive means. No other sugars? No BF/GF/wife/husband at home? Others ok if you discuss first? There are so many ways to interpret things, the best thing seems to be to discuss every new arrangement as just that….NEW and different.

  202. Michael AZ Alleycat says:

    first!

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